“The names of Harry and Meghan do not crop up very often in court circles.”

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry may have left the royal family, but they’re still a topic of discussion at the palace. And according to a royal author, the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have been given some pretty cold nicknames within the palace.

In his new book, A Voyage Around the Queen, which hits shelves tomorrow, author Craig Brown claims that while Meghan and Harry’s real names don’t get brought up too often in royal circles, the estranged family members are referred to indirectly, per The Mirror. David Albert Charles Armstrong-Jones, second Earl of Snowdon is quoted in Brown’s book saying, “The royal family is quite good at blanking out anything unpleasant or uncomfortable.”

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Broadcaster Gyles Brandreth also told Brown that members of the family have a pretty icy way of referring to the couple.

“These days, the names of Harry and Meghan, the Duke and Duchess of Sussex, do not crop up very often in court circles…,” Brandreth explained. “When they do, courtiers flinch almost imperceptibly and change the subject—or, if that’s not possible, refer to them obliquely as ‘persons who live overseas.'”

“Mention the Sussexes to other members of the royal family…and they simply smile briefly and say, ‘We wish them all the best’—and nothing else,” Brandreth added.

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The duke and duchess, however, reportedly had much more endearing secret nicknames back when they were working royals. According to Express, a recent report revealed the names given to Harry and Meghan by their security personnel. The staff called them “DS,” which stands for Duke and Duchess of Sussex. However, the two would go by David Stevens and Davina Scott. Harry’s brother, Prince William, and his wife, Kate Middleton, had similar code names: Daphne Clark and Danny Collins, derived from Duke and Duchess of Cambridge.