Episode 5 director Clare Kilner also tells TheWrap she didn’t want Daemon’s latest nightmare to ‘feel voyeuristic’

Alicent Hightower in “House of the Dragon” (Credit: HBO)

Note: This story contains spoilers from “House of the Dragon” Season 2, Episode 5.

“House of the Dragon” Season 2, Episode 5, trudges through the fallout from the fatal Battle at Rook’s Rest, with all sides grieving while looking for a path forward.

Director Clare Kilner has handled a number of episodes in the HBO drama series that deal with the loss of major characters. She directed “The Green Council” in Season 1, which unpacked Viserys’ (Paddy Considine) death, and this season she shot “Rhaenyra the Cruel,” which dealt with the aftermath of Blood & Cheese.

Kilner told TheWrap that Episode 5 stood out because Rhaenyra (Emma D’Arcy) and Alicent (Olivia Cooke) are feeling “muffled” by their councils.

“I was thinking about the women and how they’re kept in their castles and kept in their place for so long,” Kilner said “Things are getting worse and worse and their feelings of wanting peace or revenge or somehow to stop this is building.”

Off in Harrenhal, Daemon (Matt Smith) continued to face struggles of his own. His nightmares haven’t stopped since he arrived at the castle — a historically haunted and cursed location. His latest trip saw him getting intimate with his own mother before finding blood on his hands and her neck. Kilner said it was important that the scene not “feel voyeuristic.”

“We all were thinking about how we wanted to present this so that it’s not just a gag,” she said. “There’s something happening to him deep inside.”

Below, Kilner broke down those key scenes, as well as the horrific detail that went into Aegon’s (Tom Glynn-Carney) surgery, and why the people of King’s Landing started turning on Team Green.

TheWrap: You’ve been responsible for a number of these death fallout episodes — the episode following Viserys’ death, after Blood and Cheese and now Rhaenys’ death. How did you want to differentiate the feeling of loosing Rhaenys compared to these past deaths?

Claire Kilner: At the very beginning when we do a read through of all eight scripts, I was thinking about the women and how they’re kept in their castles and kept in their place for so long. Things are getting worse and worse, and their feelings of sort of wanting peace or revenge or somehow to stop this is building.

I think it’s very much about rage that’s sort of building inside them because they have their hands tied behind their back. They can’t go out and do what everyone else is doing. They feel muffled.

I think in one hand there’s this sort of rage and anger building in them, but rage can be fire and fuel for change. They aren’t really even allowed to show that or demonstrate that as much as the men are. The grief and sadness is building fuel to try to look at their world and find a different way to change their mindset and think outside the box.

There’s a theme throughout the episode of the women in power being underestimated and railroaded, and that really comes to a head when Alicent is passed over for Aemond in that high council scene. How did that theme factor in when you were staging and constructing that moment?

For every scene, I do loads of prep beforehand in terms of breaking down the scene and looking at the characters, but I also walk onto the set with my DP and we talk about if we had just one long shot how would we shoot it. I was just like ‘this would all be on Alicent. I could shoot this whole scene on Alicent.’ Also because Olivia Cooke just quietly brings everything. Behind those eyes there is so much going on.

Sometimes you don’t know if studio or people will let you do that. Everyone was on board with that. It just became so patently obvious that this huge betrayal was happening. There’s a lot going on in these small council scenes, with lots of actors and lots of character arcs, and we just found that lovely shot where Larys looks at Cole behind her back which was so perfect. It’s so Machiavellian.

Baela starts stepping into more power. Was part of the goal shooting the scenes with her and Rhaenyra, and maybe moreso her and Corlys, that she’s ready to try to fill the power void Rhaenys left? It seemed like Corlys was seeing a bit of Rhaenys in her.

Bethany and I talked about the scene a lot and we were like she really needs to grow up in this scene. Sometimes the character is gentle and has a sweetness, but we were talking this scene she has to step up and grow up for Rhaenys.

I think it’s always easier, sometimes, to grow up for someone else — for the sake of someone else more than for yourself. She just brought such depth and pathos to the scene.

Meleys’ head being carted through King’s Landing has a Red Wedding feel, where Grey Wind’s head is mounted on Robb’s body and paraded around. How did you want to convey that in a scene where a moment meant to be a celebration starts to blow up in Team Green’s face?

I really wanted Cole and Ser Gwayne to come into town – the knights saying ‘look what we’ve done, we’ve slain the dragon – and then smallfolk are already going through a lot at the moment because there’s a lack of food, things are getting a bit dodgy in their world.

We had a ton of extras in Spain. They turn around and start to gradually swarm and surround and hear the clarion call of return and then see the head. It’s like a religious experience because it’s like their god has been slain. They really fall to their feet, and it takes a minute for Cole and Ser Gwayne that they’re falling to their feet in disgust and horror and fear.

What went into shooting Aegon’s reveal from the box up into the room and revealing the extent of his wounds? It certainly felt like a horror movie.

We wanted to focus on the box that he’s being carried in a bit at the beginning, and as he’s being carried through the streets to pique the viewers interest like ‘what’s in that box, what’s going on?’

In the book, there are descriptions of Aegon’s armor being melted to his skin. Were you able to go as gross as you wanted to while shooting the maesters working on him?

Yes. There’s so much work that went into that scene from so many different departments. We had probably about 10 meetings drilling down on all the details that we needed.

For a start we had Waldo Mason doing all the prosthetics, all the burns and the broken bones. Then we have amazing hair and make up departments that have this scalp with little bits of hair that you could actually tweeze out while we’re shooting. Costume had to build a number of stages and armor and how we can pull the armor off because part of it is meant to be burned off.

We got a medieval doctor who’s researched medieval surgery and he talked to us about all the different options. There’s a myriad different things you could do and how you would clean the wounds and what you would put on them, and how you’d have to pick out broken bone.

We really wanted to feel like he could die at any moment, and poor Tom Glynn-Carney is lying on that bed for 12 hours straight. You can’t move him because all that blood and pus will ooze out and there won’t be continuity.

How did you want to approach Daemon’s latest Harrenhal nightmare — particularly the one between him and his mother?

I struggled at the beginning. I just didn’t want it to feel voyeuristic, and I wanted there to be some deep connection with this woman. I started thinking about it like an artsy poem and that came because Emily Lambert, the actress, was just very intelligent and deep-thinking young woman and there was a lot of chemistry. We all were thinking about how we wanted to present this so that it’s not just a gag – there’s something happening to him deep inside.

We shot takes of Emily doing the dialogue and then staying when she wasn’t doing dialogue so we’d have a lot of scope to intercut it in the edit. Matt [Smith] had this great idea for the blood and we worked out how the trail of blood on her neck and then he looks at his hands – it sort of has a Shakespearean feel to it.

Then I also just thought ‘well what if Simon Strong is actually just in the room.’

I do love him being the person to rip Daemon out of each one of these trips so far.

It’s brilliant. He’s such a great actor. I just put him on this little stool and would shout ‘Ok pop up now!’

This is a really strong episode for Jace — he starts coming into his own at The Twins and later pitching the Sowing to his mom — realizing he’s pretty good at being the politician. How did you work with Harry [Collett] to show Jace hitting his stride?

I really like that last scene because it’s a mother who knows she should be very angry with her son because he went off and did something — almost like he snuck out and stayed out late, not telling her where he was. He comes back and she’s been waiting and should be angry but he tells her this amazing thing. He really steps up and he did it all for her.

I think what Jace has really sensed while discussions are happening — he stands there very astute and listening — and I think he realized that there’s a vacuum. Nobody really knows what to do and even the big honchos are at a bit of a loss. He quietly goes and does this because he wants to show that he’s a man and can be trusted.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

New episodes of “House of the Dragon” air Sundays on HBO and stream on Max.